WarnerMedia sold to Discovery Networks, renamed Warner Bros. Discovery

[lowell]

The Zaslav's plan is to get Warner Media's debt down to zero and then sell the company to Universal, at least that's what it's looking to be now.

I didn't think that Comcast/NBCUniversal was big enough to buy WB, but if this happens (assuming that the FCC doesn't block such a move), then that would mean Looney Tunes, Woody Woodpecker and Felix the Cat would all be under one umbrella!

Zaslav’s not going to be able to get the debt down to zero.

The suitor who buys WarnerDiscovery will have to take care of the remaining amount of debt that Zaslav can’t pay off.

It's too bad that Warner Bros. isn't financially strong enough to stand on its own. I'd like to see WB owned by some company that would treat its properties well.

Jeff Bewkes actually doomed WarnerMedia from the beginning by not growing it with acquisitions, not allowing synergies between WB, Turner, and HBO, and only focusing on guaranteeing his golden parachute exit payment after selling the company to AT&T.

Authorities already permitted one merger of two Big Six studios.

They won't permit another (which is why Sony can't buy Paramount Global)

Amazon is better because there is much sentiment for reuniting the MGM libraries, as well as the ability to build a WB theme park.

Technically, Big Six at this point since Netflix, by paying $12 million annually as a membership fee to the MPAA, now fills 20th Century Fox's spot in the Big Six studios.

If Amazon pays for the annual MPAA membership, it becomes the Big Seven.

Amazon buying WarnerDiscovery would make it the Big Six again.

If Sony and Paramount eventually got together, you would still get the Big Five studios.

As long as it ends up being that there are multiple competitors, it’s pretty much like it is now.

I would say that nothing can actually be absolute at this point because the landscape continues to evolve enough to the point when something actually happens, it’s because of the changes over the years.

 

[PF9]

Since WBD is already going to combine HBOmax and Discovery+, I would suspect that if Amazon eventually purchases the company, this combined streamer would be folded into Prime Video, with existing subscribers to the WBD service that didn't have Prime already being given the option of subscribing to all of Prime, or just Prime Video.

 

[lowell]

Since WBD is already going to combine HBOmax and Discovery+, I would suspect that if Amazon eventually purchases the company, this combined streamer would be folded into Prime Video, with existing subscribers to the WBD service that didn't have Prime already being given the option of subscribing to all of Prime, or just Prime Video.

There’s an equal chance Prime Video could be folded into the superservice and people with Prime memberships could just have access to it.

The service that has the better user interface will be the one surviving.

 

[Moe]

Speaking about consolidate, it is just WB and Discovery contents will be on new service, and HBO Max will be downgraded to just HBO to focus on premium contents, so revenues from HBO subscription is going to cover on original series, pay residuals to use WB films and acquire non-WB films that is usual business for HBO. That is based on news report, shared by Linus.

Amazon buying WBD isn't going happen until several years later, or possibly never if it is sold to different company. There is no guarantee about all WB contents would be included in Prime, also Epix and ScreenPix haven't closed nor merge after bought by Amazon, and Amazon's business practice can be very different after own WBD, so it means Amazon is going to be selective and maintain the rotation that where selected WB contents come in and others rotated out, and they will continue to license some WB out to other services to make more money as possible. If you want ALL WB contents on Prime, don't get your hope up and Amazon want to make money that is matter.

There is no change with HBO, Cinemax, Epix and ScreenPix, even not name changes or consolidation because long-lasting contract with TV providers have to be honored until all TV providers drop the service, so those cannot be merged with Amazon Prime easily.

If there is problem with federal regulators that doom the Amazon's acquisition of WBD, so your ideal proposal is going nowhere and more complicated when WBD is sold to different company than Amazon.

 

[lowell]

Speaking about consolidate, it is just WB and Discovery contents will be on new service, and HBO Max will be downgraded to just HBO to focus on premium contents, so revenues from HBO subscription is going to cover on original series, pay residuals to use WB films and acquire non-WB films that is usual business for HBO. That is based on news report, shared by Linus.

Amazon buying WBD isn't going happen until several years later, or possibly never if it is sold to different company. There is no guarantee about all WB contents would be included in Prime, also Epix and ScreenPix haven't closed nor merge after bought by Amazon, and Amazon's business practice can be very different after own WBD, so it means Amazon is going to be selective and maintain the rotation that where selected WB contents come in and others rotated out, and they will continue to license some WB out to other services to make more money as possible. If you want ALL WB contents on Prime, don't get your hope up and Amazon want to make money that is matter.

There is no change with HBO, Cinemax, Epix and ScreenPix, even not name changes or consolidation because long-lasting contract with TV providers have to be honored until all TV providers drop the service, so those cannot be merged with Amazon Prime easily.

If there is problem with federal regulators that doom the Amazon's acquisition of WBD, so your ideal proposal is going nowhere and more complicated when WBD is sold to different company than Amazon.

Both Discovery+ and HBO Max are going to be taken out by the new service next summer:

HBO Max, Discovery+ to Merge Into Single Streaming Platform Starting in Summer 2023

Warner Bros. Discovery announced a timeline for HBO Max and Discovery+ to be fused together.

variety.com

The thing with the premium channels is that there are possibilities of negotiations between the company with the TV providers.

The regulatory matters will depend on what happens at that time, nothing is a guarantee or an absolute, anyway.

 

[Moe]

Both Discovery+ and HBO Max are going to be taken out by the new service:

No, it is for WB and Discovery, not HBO contents.

The thing with the premium channels is that there are possibilities of negotiations between the company with the TV providers.

It is not straightforward as you think and there are a lot of legacy licensing that has to be honored, so it could last for many, many years. You will never see Harry Potter films to be permanent home on WB service because of legacy licensing.

Amazon is going to left those alone and they will make a lot of money.

The regulatory matters will depend on what happens at that time, nothing is a guarantee or an absolute, anyway.

Exactly, the acquisition isn't toddler toys to be played easily but it is very complicated because you have a long list of conditions to be followed, otherwise, costly and messy lawsuits.

 

[lowell]

No, it is for WB and Discovery, not HBO contents.


It is not straightforward as you think and there are a lot of legacy licensing that has to be honored, so it could last for many, many years. You will never see Harry Potter films to be permanent home on WB service because of legacy licensing.

Amazon is going to left those alone and they will make a lot of money.


Exactly, the acquisition isn't toddler toys to be played easily but it is very complicated because you have a long list of conditions to be followed, otherwise, costly and messy lawsuits.

HBO is part of the Warner side of the company. Where is the confirmation HBO won't have a presence on that service?

 

[Moe]

HBO is part of the Warner side of the company. Where is the confirmation HBO won't have a presence on that service?

You can find in Linus' post and article explained the logical to run the service - the article is included in Linus' post.

"Max (Warner Bros. Discovery Streaming Service)" News & Discussion (Spoilers)

David Zaslav doesn't care one whit about quality programming. He just wants to make as much money as possible while spending as little money as possible. The man is a schlockmeister who's in way over his head. My hope is that Zaslav will be removed from his position before he does irreparable...

animesuperhero.com

HBO is very expensive business so it isn't going to be included in combined of Discovery and WB if Zaslav want to be affordable as Peacock and Paramount+, so it means Discovery and many WB contents that you saw on HBO Max would relocate to new service that can be sold at lower price without HBO contents. HBO will be continue to be available via TV providers and standalone, so discount would be offered if you want Discovery + WB and HBO, so discount take out of Discovery + WB, not HBO. HBO needs revenues to make original series and pay for rights to run the movies, but AT&T went too further to combine everything into HBO Max that sold at $15 per month, so that is very unprofitable because HBO contents are expensive to make.

TV providers continue to sell HBO, so it cannot be changed, so HBO must be sold as described in contract with TV providers. Zaslav's own streaming service with Discovery and WB is simply streaming service and TV providers will have no say in this case, unlike HBO.

You will understand those business if you understand the logics, and I thought you should know.

 

[lowell]

You can find in Linus' post and article explained the logical to run the service - the article is included in Linus' post.

"Max (Warner Bros. Discovery Streaming Service)" News & Discussion (Spoilers)

David Zaslav doesn't care one whit about quality programming. He just wants to make as much money as possible while spending as little money as possible. The man is a schlockmeister who's in way over his head. My hope is that Zaslav will be removed from his position before he does irreparable...

animesuperhero.com

HBO is very expensive business so it isn't going to be included in combined of Discovery and WB if Zaslav want to be affordable as Peacock and Paramount+, so it means Discovery and many WB contents that you saw on HBO Max would relocate to new service that can be sold at lower price without HBO contents. HBO will be continue to be available via TV providers and standalone, so discount would be offered if you want Discovery + WB and HBO, so discount take out of Discovery + WB, not HBO. HBO needs revenues to make original series and pay for rights to run the movies, but AT&T went too further to combine everything into HBO Max that sold at $15 per month, so that is very unprofitable because HBO contents are expensive to make.

TV providers continue to sell HBO, so it cannot be changed, so HBO must be sold as described in contract with TV providers. Zaslav's own streaming service with Discovery and WB is simply streaming service and TV providers will have no say in this case, unlike HBO.

You will understand those business if you understand the logics, and I thought you should know.

So this is what I saw on Linus's post regarding that:

3. They aren't putting Warner on Discovery Plus, that was some weird rumor and Twitter is a bad place... they only real fact is they are making a new combined service, we don't know the name, how it will look, what color it will be, how much it will cost, will it still work if you pay for HBO on cable since HBO Max is also the HBO cable subscriber catch up service? All we know is that they are going to take content from both sides and put them on one thing ...in summer 2023 (which gives them leeway to change their minds)

HBO actually does count as content from both sides.

The HBO channels will continue to be available to satellite/cable/online live TV providers.

The question is now how HBO will be part of the new service.

And the quote from the article in Linus's post:

"In the haze of last week’s rumor-a-rama, some interpreted this as a sign Team Discovery was looking to minimize HBO’s role going forward. But as Zaslav himself made clear on the earnings call, he considers HBO the “crown jewel” of the new company, so those reports are, as our current president might say, pure malarkey."

I'm guessing it'll work out as the same that HBO channel subscribers will get access to the superservice just like they're getting access to Max now but I'd probably wait for more details on this when they'll release further information on that superservice.

Also, for Paramount+ and Showtime, the bundle option exists but something else is being cooked up over there:

WSJ News Exclusive | Paramount Considers Discontinuing Showtime Streaming Service, Merging With Paramount+

The move would involve discontinuing the Showtime service, a step that would streamline the entertainment company’s offerings amid a crowd of competitors.

www.wsj.com

 

[Moe]

HBO actually does count as content from both sides.

The HBO channels will continue to be available to satellite/cable/online live TV providers.

The question is now how HBO will be part of the new service.

And the quote from the article in Linus's post:

"In the haze of last week’s rumor-a-rama, some interpreted this as a sign Team Discovery was looking to minimize HBO’s role going forward. But as Zaslav himself made clear on the earnings call, he considers HBO the “crown jewel” of the new company, so those reports are, as our current president might say, pure malarkey."

I'm guessing it'll work out as the same that HBO channel subscribers will get access to the superservice just like they're getting access to Max now but I'd probably wait for more details on this when they'll release further information on that superservice.

Did you read the article that is provided in Linus' post?

When Zaslav is desired to make a new service include Discovery and WB at affordable price, so it is obvious that HBO contents aren't going to be included, or at least, very small amount of contents, usually older one. Again, HBO is VERY expensive to make and it is sold at expensive, premium cost. There is no way for Zaslav to lose much money if HBO is in.

If you do think that HBO contents would be included, so I want to say... GOOD LUCK... *shrugs*

I guess that we have to wait, but I'm expected subscribers to pay extra for premium contents like HBO and I don't want WBD to lose the money, so they have to take care of problems.

I subscribed HBO at bundle discount with YouTube TV, so I have no plan to cancel the premium TV services.

Also, for Paramount+ and Showtime, the bundle option exists but something else is being cooked up over there:

That is for streaming service only, so Showtime will be continued to be sold by TV providers as premium service, along with access to TV provider-run on-demand service and fate of Showtime Anytime (That is for cable subscribers ONLY) is unclear. Paramount is likely to offer a discount to Showtime subscribers to have an access to Paramount+, also there are Paramount+ movies air on Showtime as well.

Showtime as premium service isn't going anywhere.

 

[lowell]

Did you read the article that is provided in Linus' post?

When Zaslav is desired to make a new service include Discovery and WB at affordable price, so it is obvious that HBO contents aren't going to be included, or at least, very small amount of contents, usually older one. Again, HBO is VERY expensive to make and it is sold at expensive, premium cost. There is no way for Zaslav to lose much money if HBO is in.

If you do think that HBO contents would be included, so I want to say... GOOD LUCK... *shrugs*

I guess that we have to wait, but I'm expected subscribers to pay extra for premium contents like HBO and I don't want WBD to lose the money, so they have to take care of problems.

I subscribed HBO at bundle discount with YouTube TV, so I have no plan to cancel the premium TV services.


That is for streaming service only, so Showtime will be continued to be sold by TV providers as premium service, along with access to TV provider-run on-demand service and fate of Showtime Anytime (That is for cable subscribers ONLY) is unclear. Paramount is likely to offer a discount to Showtime subscribers to have an access to Paramount+, also there are Paramount+ movies air on Showtime as well.

Showtime as premium service isn't going anywhere.

I did read the article but it basically aligns with what the Variety article I posted said.

What do you mean by premium service if you can clarify that?

It's all premium by definition, both the channels and the streaming service.

The channels are definitely staying because they still bring in revenue.

Why would allowing channel subscribers access to the service lose money if they can access the stuff they watched on the channel on the platform as well?

The HBO Go service was basically the "on demand" function for the channel subscribers and HBO Max continued that alongside continuing the function of HBO Now as well.

Paramount+ and Showtime already are bundled together but now they looking into possibly folding the Showtime streaming service into Paramount+.

Showtime channel subscribers that have access to Showtime Anytime would probably be getting access to Paramount+ if they fold Showtime Anytime into Paramount+ as well.

I think once they work out the details, it'll be more clear on what they're doing.

And with the "affordable" part, I think you might want to hold off on concluding that:

Warner Bros. Discovery CFO calls company's HBO Max and Discovery+ 'underpriced,' suggesting price hikes may be coming

Warner Bros. Discovery plans to combine HBO Max and Discovery+ next year, which could give the company a chance to reset pricing for its streaming service.

www.cnbc.com

 

[Moe]

What do you mean by premium service if you can clarify that?

It means contents are produced with higher cost and ads free, so new contents are designed to be exclusive on HBO for while before it is available to be syndicated on basic cable channels, and in case for streaming service, basic ads supported and regular, ads free, opposed to premium.

It means new service for WB and Discovery could include older HBO shows that are available for syndication, but as for new shows, they stay on HBO streaming service and HBO channels offered by TV providers that sold at premium cost.

The premium service isn't limited to cable, so it does include the streaming service if there is more than one service like one is for normal or entry level and other is premium.

Why would allowing channel subscribers access to the service lose money if they can access the stuff they watched on the channel on the platform as well?

HBO contents are very EXPENSIVE to make, so they need a lot of return to keep money flowing, so they can use revenues to cover on future projects.

I thought you should know about this matter.

The HBO Go service was basically the "on demand" function for the channel subscribers and HBO Max continued that alongside continuing the function of HBO Now as well.

Not really, HBO Go is for subscribers who paid HBO via TV providers and HBO Now is for subscribers who pay HBO without go thorough with TV providers, so HBO Now has been folded into HBO Max by Phone Company (AT&T), and they killed HBO Go as well, however subscribers have access to HBO only service via TV provider's on-demand service, it means on cable box or app that developed by TV providers.

Paramount+ and Showtime already are bundled together but now they looking into possibly folding the Showtime streaming service into Paramount+.

It is not forced bundle, so you still have option to subscribe Paramount+ only if you wanted, but Paramount said that they want to close Showtime streaming service (not including Anytime version for now), not forced bundle.

Showtime channel subscribers that have access to Showtime Anytime would probably be getting access to Paramount+ if they fold Showtime Anytime into Paramount+ as well.

Paramount can create a modified version of Paramount+ to allow cable subscribers to access to contents that are strictly available on Showtime. It is just like Starz did for anyone who subscribed MoviePlex only or Encore only, but it isn't matter anymore after they consolidated all into one with no app access for anyone who have MoviePlex only, but they can access to on-demand via cable box or app that provided by TV providers.

And with the "affordable" part, I think you might want to hold on concluding that:

The article generalized very much - there is no way for Discovery subscribers to pay more if HBO Max and Discovery+ are forced combined into one service with higher price, so Zaslav doesn't want to agitate their Discovery base, so it means combined service would include Discovery and WB contents (it means you saw on HBO Max like Full House, Family Matters, Big Bang Theory, etc will be included in combined service but as for newer HBO contents are out of question), also it would be much less contents when compared to HBO Max if Zaslav want to make a price affordable like Peacock.

The articles aren't going to tell everything but you may need to use logic to understand the business.

Note: We went partially off topic and please discourage from discuss about Paramount+ and Showtime because they aren't belong in here. The admin/mod can close this thread and issue the infraction. Please stay on topic about WBD as much as possible.

 

[lowell]

It means contents are produced with higher cost and ads free, so new contents are designed to be exclusive on HBO for while before it is available to be syndicated on basic cable channels, and in case for streaming service, basic ads supported and regular, ads free, opposed to premium.

It means new service for WB and Discovery could include older HBO shows that are available for syndication, but as for new shows, they stay on HBO streaming service and HBO channels offered by TV providers that sold at premium cost.

The premium service isn't limited to cable, so it does include the streaming service if there is more than one service like one is for normal or entry level and other is premium.


HBO contents are very EXPENSIVE to make, so they need a lot of return to keep money flowing, so they can use revenues to cover on future projects.

I thought you should know about this matter.


Not really, HBO Go is for subscribers who paid HBO via TV providers and HBO Now is for subscribers who pay HBO without go thorough with TV providers, so HBO Now has been folded into HBO Max by Phone Company (AT&T), and they killed HBO Go as well, however subscribers have access to HBO only service via TV provider's on-demand service, it means on cable box or app that developed by TV providers.


It is not forced bundle, so you still have option to subscribe Paramount+ only if you wanted, but Paramount said that they want to close Showtime streaming service (not including Anytime version for now), not forced bundle.


Paramount can create a modified version of Paramount+ to allow cable subscribers to access to contents that are strictly available on Showtime. It is just like Starz did for anyone who subscribed MoviePlex only or Encore only, but it isn't matter anymore after they consolidated all into one with no app access for anyone who have MoviePlex only, but they can access to on-demand via cable box or app that provided by TV providers.


The article generalized very much - there is no way for Discovery subscribers to pay more if HBO Max and Discovery+ are forced combined into one service with higher price, so Zaslav doesn't want to agitate their Discovery base, so it means combined service would include Discovery and WB contents (it means you saw on HBO Max like Full House, Family Matters, Big Bang Theory, etc will be included in combined service but as for newer HBO contents are out of question, also it would be much less contents when compared to HBO Max if Zaslav want to make a price affordable like Peacock.

The articles aren't going to tell everything but you may need to use logic to understand the business.

Note: We went partially off topic and please discourage from discuss about Paramount+ and Showtime because they aren't belong in here. The admin/mod can close this thread and issue the infraction. Please stay on topic about WBD as much as possible.

Until we get further information, I don't think they're going to branch HBO content into its own service.

But technically they actually also folded HBO Go into HBO Max if you said HBO Now was folded into HBO Max.

From the article, this was what the CFO said:

"Wiedenfels noted HBO Max won more Emmys (38) this week than any other streaming service. HBO’s “The White Lotus” snared the most awards during the prime-time ceremony with five, including Outstanding Limited Series. Warner Bros. Discovery’s strategy is to combine HBO’s award-winning programming with Discovery’s lighter reality content, which should reduce “churn,” or number of subscribers who cancel the service, Wiedenfels said."

I actually do read up on what the intentions are so far but I guess you should know much more than me as well.

Until there is confirmation that they're going to divide the HBO content out back into a separate HBO platform, I think their intention is to actually manage it all on one platform.

Full quote of the CFO from the conference he talked at:

"Look, the fundamental thesis here, and we will have to prove that out, it’s a hypothesis right now, is these perfect complements, right? I mean, we saw last night what HBO was able to produce, absolute sort of standout top-of-the-market quality content. And again, with the House of the Dragon, we’re experiencing it. Again, it can drive millions of people onto the platform. But the flip side of this kind of content is that it also drives higher churn rates. And because people come in and if you can’t convince people to then sort of get into that daily viewing habit, then some of them are going to leave again. Discovery is on the other side of the spectrum. Lowest churn rates or among the lowest churn rates in the industry. A lot of daily, very long viewing time kind of engagement. But traditionally, with the Discovery brands, it’s a lot harder to get this extreme buzz that drives sort of hundreds of thousands and millions of people onto the platform. So the thesis by combining the two, we’re creating a very, very compelling package. Over time, we can talk about news, sports, etcetera. So it’s a very, very compelling and complete offering that we’re able to bring to the market. And again, churn is one of the most important metrics here for the sustainability of this model, and I’m confident that we’re going to be able to significantly bring that down. In terms of how exactly we’re going to manage that transition, that’s something that obviously, as you would imagine, the teams are working through in a lot of detail right now. And as we get closer to the launch date, we’re going to be talking more about the more tactical elements of this."

Full transcript:

Warner Bros. Discovery, Inc. (WBD) Goldman Sachs Communacopia + Technology Conference 2022 Transcript

Warner Bros. Discovery, Inc.

seekingalpha.com

It's probably too much for them to manage multiple services at once. Hence, why I think they're looking at folding Boomerang, Bleacher Report, and Rooster Teeth as well.

I just talked about the other company's service as a comparison with what they're looking to compared to what WarnerDiscovery is doing.

 

[Moe]

HBO Max infrastructure is designed to be downgraded to HBO without need overhaul after Discovery and WB contents migrate to new service that is made by Zaslav's Discovery. After read and understand the logic, I do believe that separate WB contents from HBO is more likely than not because they want to have accessible to general audience who aren't paying a lot of money for HBO Max, so include all of HBO contents defeat the purpose to make a lot of money to pay the debt down, unless they set a price at $20 per month for ads supported and $25-$30 per month for ads free, that is very unsustainable and they will lose a lot of audiences because they aren't going to pay more.

The business plan is very different under Zaslav now, so no more Phone Company for y'all.

Boomerang isn't going anywhere because not many kids watch contents on HBO Max, so separate the service is part of consideration, but no final decision has made yet.

It is tough to run the business, so Hollywood studios aren't exception and I'm using a conservative estimate to ensure that WBD make money to run the operation and able to pay the debt down. The businesses have a lot of limitation and you have to put contents in as long as there is profit margin, so it can be used to fund the projects. Have successful film sales do help to subsidize the streaming service but it is harder to anticipate because movie sales fluctuate from year to year.

There is conclusion, it is consideration for now and there is no final decision for combined service yet. I'm going to mark this debate as serve on purpose and don't want to drag this thread further.

 

[lowell]

Yeah, we'll just see where it goes.

Of course, things could change because of the way you're thinking of the financial details behind this but I'm just following the information that's coming out from the company with the CFO's remarks being the recent update on things.

 

[Moe]

Sometime, executive's remarks aren't bind and they have to answer the shareholders' questions about operate the business and profitability, so they have to make shareholders happy.

 

[lowell]

Sometime, executive's remarks aren't bind and they have to answer the shareholders' questions about operate the business and profitability, so they have to make shareholders happy.

We'll eventually get more details about this superservice anyway so we'll find out what happens then.

 

[Moe]

superservice

or lesser when compared to HBO Max and there are number of members in here are very concerned about future combined service.

My response would be... that is unfortunate if they went routine with lesser when compared to predecessor service, also there is my role - I don't want to give a false hope and I'm just treat with caution.

 

[lowell]

or lesser when compared to HBO Max and there are number of members in here are very concerned about future combined service.

My response would be... that is unfortunate if they went routine with lesser when compared to predecessor service, also there is my role - I don't want to give a false hope and I'm just treat with caution.

There is probably a reason why they haven't exactly wanted to keep two distinct services separately as it is now.

They likely want to pool all the streaming resources into one main platform to challenge other streamers in the Streaming Wars while still licensing out content to third-parties for additional revenue.

Doing one thing doesn't rule out doing another thing.

It could be lesser but the way the messaging from them on this new service so far is just basically bring the two platforms and their subscriber bases together into one single place and expand to other countries from there.

Otherwise, they could've just bundled the two services like other bundles and not do anything else.

We could be wrong but we'll just have to wait and see because they're still working on this platform until next year.

 

[Elijah Abrams]

I wonder when WBD's next earnings report is, so we can find out about Zaslav's fate?